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Local Items: Another plane crash
Bonaire Talk: Local Items: Archives: Archives 2009: Archives 07-01-2009 to 12-31-2009: Another plane crash
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jeff Stine (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #292) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 11:49 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Had a lazy morning and as I was loading my tanks, people started running and said another plane went down.

I saw a dive boat racing in from Klein to city pier. I walked down and word on the street was a Divi Divi plane went down off of Klein. The person that I spoke to said she saw 5 people walk off of the dive boat, which is a very good thing.

No word on any other survivors or the number of souls on board.

Prayers go out to all of them.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By R.(La Femme Nikita) A. (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4668) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 11:53 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

NO! OMG, what is going on?? I hope everyone made it out okay...please updates anyone??

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By superd (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #112) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 11:59 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

my current understanding is divi and from tower freq 9 survivors. details unconfirmed and not for speculation or dissemination!!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jeff Stine (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #293) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:00 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I literally just walked back from Town Pier and posted. No new information yet. They are reporting on Bonaire TV, the reporter was right beside where I was standing. The dive boat that did the rescue may have been from Buddy's but it was moving so fast I'm not sure; it had just left the dock heading back to Klein as I got there.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By R.(La Femme Nikita) A. (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4669) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:05 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thank you for the info, hoping there were ONLY survivors. Will watch for updates.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gail T.*********** (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #4430) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:09 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Bette posted on facebook that all 9 passengers were safe. but the pilot and plane were not accounted for.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I'll always be BOOM here! (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12200) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:10 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

oh my......

will keep looking for updates and a heart full of hope and faith.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By KIV ~ Kobi in Virginia (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12865) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:13 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

OMG!!! Thoughts and prayers to everyone; how scary.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Diane and Bea (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #542) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:21 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Our thoughts and prayers out to everyone

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #141) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:43 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Staying at the Bellevue. Saw several small boats heading past Klein. A Marine park boat was working just off our shore here and took off to help. There was a helicopter hovering at the site for an hour. There is also a large Coast Guard ship holding at the site. We werent sure what had happened at the time but we found out that a plane had gone down.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pegi Sue...PegiPie...G's PS (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #11235) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:45 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I hate reading these things and not knowing the outcome....I do hope and pray that EVERYONE is ok...Please keep posting the details.....
Very Scary!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #142) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:48 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

News says all survived but pilot missing at this time. The helicopter is heading back out and the coast guard ship is still sitting there. The dive boats are all coming back. Survivors at the hospital.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #143) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:49 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I meant the dive boats are coming back to town...not back to the crash.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #144) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:50 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

It was a DA plane...not Divi.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pegi Sue...PegiPie...G's PS (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #11237) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:53 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

DAE??

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I'll always be BOOM here! (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12202) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:55 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Do we know if it was coming or going???

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pegi Sue...PegiPie...G's PS (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #11238) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 12:56 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

My above post makes no sense, it just happened, can't have all the details yet.....

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cecil* (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #7921) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 1:10 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Nothing on Goggle or the news outlets, yet, let's pray it was not a passenger plane.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By *Tink* (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #864) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 1:27 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Cecil, it is on Google. But both stories are in Dutch:-(

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By superd (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #113) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 1:34 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I think it is important to recognize the response of this tiny island to this incident. It was both selfless and complete. I had a clear view of the location but not the incident and at one point EVERY boat just aimed at this site. I did not realize the significance to begin with because it is a common fishing area. When the Don Andres was not moving it caught my attention.

At one point there were more than 20 boats on site that as far as I could tell represented just about every dive operation on the island. Very reminiscent of the Hudson. Tugs container boats and anything in the area responded. 2 helicopters and the Panther arrived post haste from Curacao.

I have seen in past years not dissimilar responses to missing divers with dive operation boats suddenly showing up at very remote parts of the island.

I think that it behooves us all to understand and respect the responsiveness of these individuals and entities at times of need. They did not speculate they just did.... perhaps not a bad example to follow.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ruth, Ken's Forever Love ) (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #2395) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 1:51 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Wow, I have tears reading this. I hope all are ok and the pilot is found. Prayers and positive vibes being sent for all those involved.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jaap van Duijvenbode (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #131) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:04 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Good morning all,

Just read about a plane crash right off Klein Bonaire.

http://www.nu.nl/algemeen/2107580/vliegtuig-neergestort-bij-bonaire.html

>AMSTERDAM - Een vliegtuig is donderdag neergestort voor de >kust van het eiland Bonaire. Een piloot heeft de ramp niet >overleefd.

A plane crashed just in front of the island of Bonaire. The captain didn't survive the plane crash.

>Dit melden lokale media. De negen passagiers en de andere >piloot overleefden de vliegtuigramp wel.
>Het toestel van de vliegtuigmaatschappij Divi Divi Air kwam in >de problemen doordat één van de twee motoren uitviel.

Local press announces 9 passengers and a co-pilot survived the crash. The aircraft of "Divi Divi air" got in trouble after one of the engines failed.

>Het vliegtuigje was op weg van Curaçao naar Bonaire, en wist >een landing te maken in de zee, aan de zuidkant van klein >Bonaire. De passagiers zijn lichtgewond overgebracht naar het >ziekenhuis.

The plane was on its way to Bonaire from Curacao, the captain managed to land the aircraft at sea, at the southern side of Klein Bonaire. Passengers were evacuated to the nearest hospital, lightly injured.

>Het toestel is gezonken.

The aircraft sank.

I hope all survivors are doing fine, unfortunately the captain gave his life and didn't survive the crash. RIP

Rgrds,
Jaap

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #22440) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:07 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thank you Jaap for the translation.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I'll always be BOOM here! (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12205) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:22 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Bette just posted this on FB:
Just watched the News on NOS tv, our local tv station.
They found the pilot and he is safe. THANK GOD!!!
What happend? Well apparently they lost the power on one engine and the pilot tried to land the plane on the water. According to one of the passengers, the water was coming in real fast and the pilot could not get out. The plane sunck very rapidly. How the pilot still managed to escape is not clear yet. The plane is still lost. Btw, it was a Divi Dive plane for sure!
They were filming on the water at the spot they believe the plane had sunck, but they only found some parts of a propeller."

So it sounds like all have survived.

Now, were there any BTrs on that plane??? Julia was in transit but she was on KLM, no?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10863) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:27 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks, Boom, a few sources I contacted had said the pilot was found and safe too. Glad to hear from a local TV station reporting it as fact. Sounds to me that the pilot did an excellent job in keeping everyone as safe as he could considering the circumstances and kudos to all the boats, etc., that came to their aid. Will look for further news on this.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I'll always be BOOM here! (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12207) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:29 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Bette just posted a correction:
"I have to correct something. The co-pilot is found safe but the captain was stuck in the plane and went down with it.

The sad part of this story is, that the one who managed to save the people he was responsable for but paid with his own life.
We have to have a great respect for such a selfless deed."

Very sad....

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brigitte Kley - Coco Palm Garden (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #834) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:37 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

But DiviDivi only has one pilot normally ?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #22442) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:40 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Sept - Oct BT list.
Aug 29-Sept12- Smack at LBR13
Sept 12-19 Bill & Chip - Playa Lechi Residence PH
Sept 23rd to Oct 4th Paul & Paula Brazier Harbour Village
Sept 26th to Oct 3 Carl and Jan LBR21
Sept 26 - Oct 10: T-Shirt Divers John and Sue
Sep 26th - Oct 3rd Big Wave Dave and Wounded Warrior Group - Capt Don's Habitat
October 2nd -20th - Joanna Bryson & Mark Marriott - Den Laman
October 3-10 - Tom Kreider w Group @ Buddy Dive
October 3-17th - Darlene Ellis - Carib Inn
Oct 3-17 - LaDonna Pride - Carib Inn
Oct 3-24th - Dave J - Carib Inn
Oct 10-24 Bill & Chip - Villa Salentein (may be on-island by the 8th)
Oct 10-17: Mel and Ellie Briscoe, with a group, at Buddy Dive
Oct 10-17: Dan Jolly at LBR (Pat Murphy's condo)
Oct 17-31st: Dave & Steph - Deep Blue View
Oct 17-31st - Diane and Ron Gould - BOA #9(Bonaire Oceanfront Apartments)
Oct 21 - Nov 4th Julia and Bob (will host mini meet, details later)
Oct 21 - Oct 28: Cynthia Brown & Bob Hawkins, Captain Don's Habitat #8
Oct 24-31 Mike and Elise - Golden Reef Inn
Oct 24 - Nov 1 Matthew & Jena Collins - Golden Reef Inn
OCT 29 - Dec 21 Trevor - Bonaire Exclusif
Oct 30 - Nov 14 Diane and Bea - Plaza Resort

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10864) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:41 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I have to take back what I posted above. I just talked to the folks staying at my place. I do not believe the captain made it out. :-( Will wait for official news.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By *Freddie* (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12961) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:45 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

doesn't look like any of the above travelers were in the air coming to Bon......I am sure we will hear all about it if there was anyone we know involved.... prayers up for the Captain :-(

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #145) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:51 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

yes it was divi. Sorry

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10865) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 2:57 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Very sad indeed. My guests were actually on one of the boats that went out to the scene to rescue anyone along with many other boats. My heart and prayers go out to the pilot and his family.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lizard0924 (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #344) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 3:29 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

more information:

http://avherald.com/h?article=4219e895

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Mc -- But you can all me Jacques (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #2390) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 3:49 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The pilot must have done one hell of a job landing the plane in the water. Kudos to him.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Remco van Reeuwijk (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #7) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 3:54 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

What awfull news. My wife and I went with Divi Divi while on honeymoon on Bonaire in 2007. We made a one day visit to Curacao and I was thrilled like a young kid to be able to sit next to the pilot with clear view in front of me. My condoleances go to family of the pilot and Divi Divi crew...

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eileen**Vegas Baby!*********** (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #14768) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 4:04 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Awful news. My sympathies to the family. A brave pilot.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Krispi*** (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #7776) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 4:18 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

this is so sad! Bless him for the sacrifice he gave!
His poor family!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vince DePietro-www.bonairebeachcondo.com (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #2513) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 4:58 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Our thoughts are with the pilot's family. Looks like he almost made it to the runway. Very sad.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By terry grainger (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #5) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 5:05 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

We were there. Diving and the plane crashed 400 feet from boat. Ended up rescuing all 9 passengers and taking them to town pier. Appeared to all have no or minor injuries.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #22450) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 5:09 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Damn good thing you guys was on site so quick.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I'll always be BOOM here! (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12212) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 5:16 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I can't even begin to imagine what that was like.

May the pilot's family find peace in his Honor.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By iTimmmy (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #6853) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 6:45 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I wonder if they will call on Walt to recover the pilot since the plane sunk in around 600 ft.of water ?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mickey McCarthy (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #799) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 7:43 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Timmy
According to my old #24461 chart the spot the plane came down at is between the 200 and 500 meter lines and so is well over 600 ft. and probably not reachable. Also, I imagine it would sort of "fly" down so Lord knows which way it went. I guess they will try to locate it though. Time will tell.
Mick

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10870) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 8:00 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I believe it went down in about 1,000 feet depth range.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Donna in the Poconos-----(*) (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #5137) on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 8:26 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

sad.....prayers for the family of the pilot..

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By terry grainger (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #6) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 8:42 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Jerry-
The DMs on our boat were true pros. Got almost everybody back to boat in record time and went right to the passengers. Most had life jackets on which was a good thing since it was obvious at least 2 couldnt swim. We salvaged a door and strut but that was all that was left. DMs who saw the crash happen said plane went down in 1 to 2 minutes at most. You couldnt hear a thing underwater and I'm guessing we were a few hundred meters away at the most. 2 of the passengers were at Mona Lisa when we were there and seemed none the worse for wear, at least physically.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Beck-ee, stayin home now for a long time (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #2368) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 9:14 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

This is so sad and so scary. My heart goes out to the family of the pilot.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mel Briscoe (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #584) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 9:17 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Terry, just curious:
Who were the DMs on the boat?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bea and Marvin Jones (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #172) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 10:24 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

There is a short article in the Daily Herald (St. Maarten).

Small plane ditches off Bonaire, pilot missing.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10882) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 11:04 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Here is an article from the Amigoe: http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_64169.php

Mel ~ I know two DM's of the boat were from Toucan and they were Jackson and Pieter. I know this from guests who are staying at my place were also on that boat. He did tell me this and I quote him on this "Jackson and Pieter from Toucan handled everything calmly and with professional excellence. Besides the pilot, they were the real heros in rescuing the passengers/survivors. The rest of us on the boat helped in various ways (all without being asked or directed), but they were the two who clearly were in control."

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mel Briscoe (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #585) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 12:42 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks, Debbie.
I'm truly sorry for the loss of life, but I imagine it would have been much worse without the professionalism of the pilot and the DMs. Silver linings.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Smits (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #739) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 3:06 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I'm no expert on planes:
could anyone explain to me if a two engined plane is supposed to be able to fly on one engine?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mickey McCarthy (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #800) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 3:23 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Bob
I believe that is true. The Amigoe article above mentions that it may have been over weight, which unfortunately would explain the incident.
Slowly loosing altitude and running out before reaching Bonaire.
Mick

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10888) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 4:04 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Here is a YouTube Video Tribute to the brave captain and passengers. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3bbfkQgK40

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pegi Sue...PegiPie...G's PS (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #11241) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 5:24 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I'm very sad hearing all of this. Our pilot in May, his name was Robert....he called me over to be his co-pilot. All I know was that he was young and OH SO VERY NICE!!!! This is so sad....

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By YucatanPat (Sand$ Condo) (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #389) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 5:43 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I am currently a student pilot, so this really hits home. Bob, lots of factors go into your question including fuel, weight, wind and air density. Twins are generally built to be able to fly with one engine but nine passengers and luggage would complicate things. My guess is the pilot did his best to maintain altitude and get as close to the airport before his decent and came up short of the runway. All pilots are trained in "no power" flight/glide and landings. He would have been in direct contact with air traffic control so I would think we will have more answers as they sort it out and release information. Just such a shame the pilot lost his life.

Patrick

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By *Tink* (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #877) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 6:03 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

In Debbie's video they have the conversation between the pilot and air traffic control. Also, if you look in the comments to the video, Erik posted, he was on the plane. Go to his youtube page and he has a link to a news interview about the crash.

So sad...

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By YucatanPat (Sand$ Condo) (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #390) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 6:22 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks Tink, watched it just now. So sad indeed....

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I'm back....at last PBD has subsided!! (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3082) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 6:43 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

:-( condolences to the Pilots family, RIP :-(

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By s fuller (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #1) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 11:36 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I had the great pleasure of flying with captain Rob Mansell, a professional pilot and in true testimony to his skills was able to save the lives of 9 passengers on board his aircraft.

you paid the ultimate sacrifice but i know you loved the job. i also know that your family were so proud of your achievements.
Rest in peace my friend i will miss you
captain: Rob mansell Died 22nd November 2009 A hero

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Goodwin * (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #563) on Saturday, October 24, 2009 - 12:11 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

In regards to twin engine flying. I am a certified flight instructor and may be able to shed some light on an engine out in a twin engine plane.

First, Pat is right, there are many factors involved with an engine out scenario. Weight, pilot experience, plane maintenance, wind, etc. Also, depending on which engine failed, the right or the left, specific aerodynamic issues can arise.

However, keep in mind that only large jets are "required" to perform well on a single engine. Most normally aspired, piston twins are barley able to maintain altitude with one engine out, let alone climb. With the weight this plane was probably carrying, the working engine probably did little more than prolong the time available to get everyone ready for the impact.

And remember, since it was on approach from Cur to Bonaire and it crashed near Klein, I would assume it was configured for it's final approach, which meant it had the engine power pulled back, as the pilot anticipated the landing. With the power of the engines pulled back, and one fails, there would be pretty severe torque and sideways yaw caused from the drag of the dead engine and the power of the working engine. That torque would be increased if the pilot pushed the throttle of the operating engine forward trying to increase his power and glide.

The drag from the dead engine, coupled with the torque and yaw caused by the working engine, causes the plane to fly along in a slip. The slip increases drag causing the nose to drop. The pilot instinctively pulls the yoke back to try and keep the plane airborne. This causes the airspeed to drop, yaw and torque to increase, which drains the airspeed, causing the nose to drop more. The pilot pulls back a bit and the cycle starts over. Eventually, the plane runs out of airspeed and stalls. This all happens in a very short time -- possibly less than a minute.

If the pilot maintains his cool and has been trained well and has recently gone through recurrent training, then he would realize the predicament, accept his fate, and prepare for a water landing, which is what he apparently did. And in doing so, saved 9 lives. There's no way anyone would've survived if the plane had stalled and spun in.

Cudos to the pilot. He was a professional.

But to answer some thoughts from earlier. I would not expect the Divi plane to be able to fly on one engine, let alone maintain altitude and make it to the airport. The plane is underpowered and not designed to carry the load they fill them with.

My disclaimer is that I am not an NTSB investigator and have no idea what really happened. This post is in response to the post regarding twin engines being able to fly on one engine (most can not). The above scenario is a textbook example that has been documented multiple times in NTSB reports. And.... it's just my 2 cents worth.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie Sturgeon (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #1) on Saturday, October 24, 2009 - 7:28 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/west_midlands/8323711.stm

From the BBC today.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John "Smack" Anderson (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1843) on Saturday, October 24, 2009 - 9:11 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks for the info, Dave. I agree with you fully and the pilot did a very professional job. Nine passengers living to tell the tale is more than I would expect in a case like this.

I would add to your explanation that he requested a flight level 035(3500ft) before takeoff. Even if he achieved that altitude before the engine loss, 3500ft is not much in the aviation world. He had his hands full and time(altitude) was not on his side. It appears he made the best of a bad situation.

Also, this A/C type was manufactured in several versions(enhancements/upgrades). Max T/O weight, engine HP and airframe modifications were incorporated over the years. I have no knowledge of this particular A/C but it would seem to me that would also come into play.

Robert, IMO, you just earned the ultimate set of wings. RIP!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kathy Lawson (BonaireTalker - Post #48) on Saturday, October 24, 2009 - 11:18 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

We were flying a Divi Divi flight several years ago and lost an engine after departure from bonaire ... we had departed and as we continued climbing, made the turn toward Curacao ... about the time we'd reached Klein, we heard a pop ... i was riding up front with the pilot ... my friend and I are both licensed pilots and knew exactly what had happened ... i turned back and looked at him and we just shook our heads ...

for most people, i don't think anybody would have known what had happened until we changed direction ... the pilot did such a phenomenal job of maintaining control of the aircraft on just one engine and the left one at that (not sure whether these were counter rotating props ... if not, even more credit to the pilot...) he simply feathered the prop and continued flying ... you never felt any torque or yaw.

both situations are certainly a testament to the quality and skill of pilots flying for divi divi ...

RIP Robert ... you first and foremost flew the airplane ... you were the ultimate professional ...

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mercy Baron (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #519) on Saturday, October 24, 2009 - 12:06 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

My ex husband, who lives in Finland, just sent me the article from the BBC News about the crash.

I don't know what else I could add, except I wish a peaceful transition for this brave pilot who saved so many lives.

My son is also a pilot and the same age as this hero, so my heart goes out to Mr. Mansell's family and friends.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brian ******* (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4639) on Saturday, October 24, 2009 - 3:47 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Wow this guy was a hero, a good few years I did some work for BAE? and my consultants had a tour of the training school. Seeing the twin engine planes and the single engine trainers, they asked if the pilots preferred the twin engines. They were told no the singles were the first choice in both cases the plane would go down, but twice as often with thr twins. Robert came from close to us - only 30 miles away, do we know were is going to be laid to rest? if here I would go pay respect on behalf of BTr's

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Goodwin * (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #564) on Saturday, October 24, 2009 - 10:23 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Smack,

Good points.

One thing to know about Divi: Their "standard" altitude from Cur to Bonaire is 3500 ft. And from Bonaire to Cur is only 2500 ft!

We flew with them a few years ago and I got this information from talking with the pilot.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I'll always be BOOM here! (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12245) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 2:57 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

This thread makes me very proud and humble...

what an amazing group we have here

what an amazing Pilot Mr. Mansell was.

Thank you all for your insight.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Thexton (BonaireTalker - Post #13) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 6:43 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I think it is fairly standard to have 1000ft separation for flight paths.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ann Phelan - www.bonairecaribbean.com (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3918) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 6:44 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

My friend from Antigua called me last night and tole me Pilot Mansell, who once flew for Winair was originally from the Midlands. So is my friend. The story was on BBC.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ann Phelan - www.bonairecaribbean.com (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3919) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 8:06 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Pilot Franklin Antoin, formerly with Divi made a tribute to Pilot Mansell. I loaded it onto www.bonairebliss.com

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10907) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 3:35 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

From the Amigoe: http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_64214.php

I am very glad to hear that they are going to bring up the plane and captain so the family can have closure of some sort.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Greg & Lani Muelrath (BonaireTalker - Post #61) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 4:16 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Having recently flown in this aircraft in the front seat next to the pilot, I know firsthand that the quarters are very cramped. As hard as I tried to retract my body parts (I’m 6-4) away from the “dashboard”, the pilot needed to tell me three times to keep my limbs away from the controls.

As the door is to the pilot’s left, how is it possible the passenger seated in what is usually considered the co-pilot’s seat was able to escape? He’d have to open the door and crawl over the pilot…hard to imagine that’s possible in such cramped space…just wondering.

Also: if this aircraft is designed to fly with only one engine, did it have to ditch because the weight limit was exceeded? And if the pilot reported an engine problem 5-minute out, wouldn’t protocol dictate returning to Hato? As a traveler who will be flying DiviDivi again in the near future, this accident raises unsettling questions.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Greg & Lani Muelrath (BonaireTalker - Post #62) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 4:33 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

PS to the above post:

A quote from pilot’s father from an article linked below:

“Mansell’s father, Roger, said his son had repeatedly told him that the Caribbean airline’s planes were overloaded as passengers and luggages were not weighed properly.

“I am furious,” he said. “If you have nine people on board and a plane is overloaded and a problem develops, it becomes much harder to fix.”

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6889041.ece#

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie B. ~ Jersey Gal(*) (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #10908) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 4:40 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Greg & Lani, They are still investigating it. I am sure more info will come out as it is known. If you read the article from the Amigoe above your post that I just posted, it says quote "Why the pilot had chosen to continue flying instead of returning and if the aircraft had excess weight as suggested earlier, should become apparent from the investigation. “Robert had probably acted to the best of his abilities. There is nothing we can say on the ‘why’,” said Richie."

It has NOT been established that the aircraft had excess weight, JUST suggested. Still a lot of unknowns out there in what you are asking. Also, you really don't know what happened to all the doors on impact either, one door was retrieved from the crash. So..let's just wait and see what they find out.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Goodwin * (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #565) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 6:27 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Dave Thexton,

You are correct, 1000 ft separation is pretty standard, and at those altitudes (and the regular fair conditions) the flights are operated at what is known as VFR -- visual flight rules. They are not expected to encounter "instrument" conditions, i.e. bad weather.

The point that Smack was making is that at those altitudes, 3500 & 2500 feet, if a problem develops, there is very little time/altitude to resolve it. The old pilot adage "altitude is my friend" comes into play here. The higher you are above the ground, the more time you have to work out a problem before being forced to return to Mother Earth.

And remember, very few piston twins are designed to fly on one engine. And if they are, it is under absolute perfect conditions, maintenance, skill.And the best most of them can do is barley maintain their already established altitude.

I agree with Debbie: there are a lot of unknowns. But like most aviation accidents, especially ones where the pilot does not survive, the answers may never be fully known.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By pat murphy (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #2418) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 7:47 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

after an afternoon of watching football i can attest that armchair quarterbacking, while easy, does no one any good. let's try to keep the speculation to a minimum until more facts are revealed. i'm sure the passengers will be interviewed extensively and when the plane is recovered maybe more can be learned from it.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By superd (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #116) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 9:41 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

For those of you who are not aware of the location... this is the north west corner of Klein taken about midday on that unfortunate day.

site

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Greg & Lani Muelrath (BonaireTalker - Post #63) on Sunday, October 25, 2009 - 11:14 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Several external/internal shots of Div Divi’s PJ-Sun. The last shot taken through the cockpit window of Flamingo Airport is probably not too far from where the plane ditched.

1

2

3

4

5

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brigitte Kley - Coco Palm Garden (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #836) on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 8:08 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Greg, you have been flying to Bonaire you said.
Would you not be glad that the pilot had to water close to Bonaire instead off the cost of Hato ? I would .....
Anyhow, so many unknowns and lots of gossip on the streets and even in the news papers, I prefer not to speculate .....

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By pat murphy (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #2419) on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 2:06 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

AOL has a story about the crash on it's home page today.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Joffe (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #1) on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 4:38 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The single engine climb rate under standard temperature and pressure for this airplane is 145 feet per minute. At 86 degrees at sea level, and the humidity that day as well as a full passenger load, there is no way that level flight can be maintained. I beleive the local carriers and or government need to re-evaluate their regulations to address this by either limiting passenger loads, requiring higher cruise altitudes to extend glide range, or require higher performance aircraft. That said, he did an excellent job ditching it. May he RIP.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By *Tink* (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #882) on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 7:35 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Brian, please let us know if the services for this hero are planned, and if you attend and represent BTers...I have tears, so sad.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By JOBY (BonaireTalker - Post #86) on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 9:50 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I suggest you re-read the message from Dave Goodwin before trying to make suggestions that the airlines need to limit their load, or hinting that it was overloaded. Many people who actually do know about these things will tell you that none of it would have made any difference. What would have made a difference would have been an inexperienced pilot, who would possibly have done the wrong thing and ended up losing all on board.
I'd still rather fly with Divi than any of the other possibilities.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #1) on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 11:39 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I am an ATPL ( Airline transport pilot) with 9000 hrs under my belt. over the years I have flown various aircraft 29 to be precise. in my career I have had 4 engine failures of which 2 were catastrophic i.e. the engines caught on fire, whether through experience or just plane luck I managed to walk away from them all.

however if I have only learnt one thing in aviation that is: Fact, if you overload an aircraft your performance is Significantly reduced

Fact: when you overload an aircraft and then you lose an engine you will not be able to maintain altitude.

Fact: in the above mentioned situation depending on your particular aircraft and how much you've overloaded by, you can expect to lose any where between 300/600 Feet per minute in altitude.

Fact: at low altitude your options are limited

Fact most budget airlines and small operators are guilty of putting pressure on their pilots to fly over loaded aircraft, while their paper work show's that they were not.

on my part there is no speculation as to the Divi aircraft crash. Just "FACT"

My heart goes out to a aviation brother may you rest in pease

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By emma jane (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #1) on Tuesday, October 27, 2009 - 10:15 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

this Question is in response to the last post.

John I only have two questions for you.
WHY are these companies putting me and others at risk?
WHY am I not informed about the load issue?
Surely I have the right to know whether my life will be endangered before boarding that aircraft, and that decision (risk) is for me to take not yours or the companies.

(Message edited by emma_jane on October 27, 2009)

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Sue (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #298) on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 9:01 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I can only relate to a flight I took in August on the same type of plane Insel is/was flying at the time.
I took a flight from CUR - BON, 8 passagers plus pilot, 5 of us were divers so 2 bags apiece plus carry ons. My bags were around 40 lbs apiece I am not a feather weight and either were 2 of the other divers. So the weight was right up there.
When I took the flight back to CUR there was 4 passagers and pilot. I got to sit in the back and was able to read a plate on the baggage compartment door that said the weight in that area should not excede 300 lbs.
Now going back to my trip from CUR-BON, do I think the load was a over, yep. Plus, when we went to get on the plane and they tried to get our carry ons back there and some would not fit.

Will I be flying on those planes again, nope. They are probably safe, but guess what, if I am not comfortable in a situation then I do not think twice about not doing it and I flown all over in different types/sizes of planes and this is one plane I will not be going on.

After reading about this accident, that night I just thought about all that I saw with Insel and decided there are other ways to get to Bonaire.

Just to add one thing, when I have taken other small planes where weight might be a problem - everything was weighed before you and whatever got on the plane. In Ft. Lauderdale one time they weighed at the counter then before we got on the plane there was a scale right by the plane too.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Goodwin * (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #566) on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 9:38 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Emma Jane,

Answer to both questions: Profit margin.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By ChicagoRandy (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #934) on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 11:50 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

To add a bit to what Dave IMHO correctly said, profit. I have no reason to doubt the 300# baggage limit in the cargo area of the puddle-jumper aircraft Sue flew. So a 9 passenger plane allows 33-1/3 pounds of "stuff" per passenger? Sounds about right to me.

Now figure the average diver/tourist 'could' be schlepping 100 pounds plus of 'stuff' between checked luggage and carry on?

Wouldn't take too many divers to exceed gross safe weight limit on a prop plane would it? A instant self inflicted safety concern.

Relatively safe way to avoid a potential disaster? Fly direct on a jet aircraft and leave the puddle-jumpers to the locals going back and forth with less 'stuff'.

Will folks stop overloading their bags? probably not. Will there be more bad endings? statistically not too many, flying is still safer than driving to the airport. Would I get on one of them cram-em-in prop jobs? Not bloody likely.

Should the regional airlines strictly enforce their own rules and regs? You betcha! Will costs of course increase carrying fewer passengers and suitcases? Yep? and worth every cent in my honest and humble opinion.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Krispi*** (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #7857) on Friday, October 30, 2009 - 1:21 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6889041.ece#

This article was so sad! I would like to add my condolences with the other BT'ers Robert's family and friends.

Rob was a hero!

Bless you Robert Mansell...Rest in Peace!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Smits (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #744) on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 4:49 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

In "the Telegraaf"

The Dutch government will soon provide funds to salvage the crashed plane.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Smits (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #753) on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 4:02 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

The Dutch government has commissioned the Rotterdam company “Smit” to salvage the remains of the 32 year old pilot Rob Mansell.

A team went to Bonaire yesterday to make preparations.
It’s the intention to start the operation this week.
A underwater robot will be used, because the plane is at a depth of 170m.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Trevor Naylor (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #102) on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 8:10 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I was out at Klein this afternoon and it looks as if a special boat is there now.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Glen Reem (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3130) on Tuesday, December 1, 2009 - 3:35 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Smit is one of the foremost worldwide salvage (and more) companies. <http://www.smit.com/>

It will be interesting to see if an aviation safety investigation is done to check on the engine failure cause, the plane's loading and why the pilot's seatbelt could not be released. Any answers could enhance future safety.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Smits (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #757) on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 1:40 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The plane was salvaged this morning.
The plane appeared intact. Recovery was hindered because the plane was resting atop a submarine telephone cable at a depth of 170 meters.
Aboard was the body of the pilot, Robert Manzell.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fredster (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #13386) on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 1:46 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

thank you for this information Bob.. are you on Bon??? or did you read this??

God bless Robert's soul..his family can now rest.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gail T.*********** (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #4572) on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 2:13 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Ruth van Tilburg-Obre posted on facebook about an hour ago that the recovery was completed.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jeff Stine (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #309) on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 7:54 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I received the same information from a friend of mine that was aboard the recovery vessel. He said that there was very little obvious damage to the aircraft. Very sad.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Oliveira (LBR28) (BonaireTalker - Post #80) on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 8:15 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

This afternoon, while sitting at a bar across the street from Karel's I watched the SMITH and another larger red ship transfer stuff to each other. I could not make out what or to what ship stuff was being transferred to.

On a couple of occasions these ships pulled up tight to each other and one could see the crane from the large ship in operation.

At Approx. 4PM the SMITH left the other ship and waited until 5PM for a cruise ship to leave to take it's place at the pier (work pier). On the stern of the SMITH there was 3 or 4 large boxes, similar to the containers used for cargo on airplanes. The larger "red" ship headed back out to sea.

The buzz on the island is what has already been posted, that the plane and the pilot's body have been recovered. If true, may God watch over him and give his family peace and the strength to deal with this sad situation.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom*** (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1439) on Friday, December 18, 2009 - 9:08 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

http://bonairereporter.com/

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By ChicagoRandy (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #948) on Saturday, December 19, 2009 - 11:12 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Remarkably less damage to the plane that I was expecting to see.

It is good that the pilot's family can now begin their slow path to closure.

 


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