Sint Nicholaas is coming tonight right??

That's one way to air out the old slippers! Is he arriving tonite in certain places?? How exciting! Keep us posted, OK, Annie?? Carole

I thought it was on the 5th at night? We are getting Quinn's slippers all ready.

I thought it was the night of the 5th / 6th but a local kid told Mags 4/5th?? Help....

I am pretty sure it is the 5th at night, that what we used to do when my sister and I were young, (OK, my husband and I still do this) and now we are starting St. Nicholas Day with Quinn.

I checked on the internet too, it looks like the 5th.

Um, why does one put out one's slippers?

A curious Mare

Here in Holland, children have been placing their shoes in front of the heating system for about 2 weeks. They want to get presents from St. Nikolaas, a saint that is well known for his generosity towards children. He gives the biggest presents on Dec. 5-th in the evening. He has some help from a number of "zwarte pieten". It's always an exciting time for the children.

We now know where Martin will be putting all of his shoes tonight.

(Message edited by vtscuba on December 5, 2004)

Criminy..you would think a child would know..should I grab the stuff now before Maggie wakes up?? Haa...I went to bed before Martin and Eileen's post..LOL

I think that if I would put my shoe there, it will be the last thing we hear from Sint Nikolaas ad his zwarte pieten...

Anne, put them out tonight too :-)
Gifts two nights in a row ... cool !
What a great guy that St. Nikolaas .

But why the shoes? Does it alert St. Nicholas that someone is there? How did the "shoe" part start?? It sounds charming, tho. Carole

Carole, It's for the small gifts, tonight they are brining a big bag with LARGE presents...

Thanks, Martin! Hope everyone had some slippers outside and are now ready for the large gifts, too. Hugs. Carole

We just celebrated our sinterklaas.
The kids were very excited. Sinterklaas came, accompanied by 2 "pieten".
Our 2 youngest kids still "believe" in him and were very excited with their present.
They had to sing a song for him and he told them of all the good things he heard about them. Of course there we some points the kids could improve and they promised to work on that the next 12 months

It is good to see so many grown-ups still believe in Sinterklaas.
Because I am experienced, I believe already more then half a century in St. Nicolaas, or Sinterklaas, I can help you out.
Originally children are putting their shoes in front of the chimney several weeks in advance of the birthday of Sinterklaas. They also put some food for the horse of Sinterklaas (carrots and so) in the shoe. It is a shoe, because Sinterklaas can see on the shoe from which child it is, so that the correct presents are getting to the right children, and the obedient children get the biggest presents.
Sinterklaas rides on his white horse (grey) over the roofs, accompanied with zwarte Pieten, who, of course are black, because they have to clean the chimneys, to be sure the presents are going through, and stay clean. In the weeks before the 6th, the children get small presents in their shoes, and Sinterklaas appears occasionally on the evenings to talk with the children and looks in his big book where all the bad behaviours of the children are stated (i.c. what the parents told him before). If the child really had bad manners, Sinterklaas says that his zwarte Pieten will put the child in the big brown bag, they always carry, and, take them with him to Spain. Actually I never heard that this ever has happened.... His official birthday is the 6th of december, and originally in the night of the 5th on the 6th Sinterklaas puts his presents in the room where the shoes were placed, so the small children find their big presents in the morning of the 6th. Half a century ago (I don't know how it is nowadays), children were free from school to play with their toys on the 6th. After bringing his presents to all the children Sinterklaas would leave our country for Spain, also on the 6th.
Later, when children got older, let's say about over 6 years old, there were no presents anymore, but there was a "pakjesavond", no translation found in the dictionary, but it should be something like "gifts-evening". This event was normally on the evening of the 5th of December. People give each other presents with always some kind of poem included in which the receiver gets remarks about his behaviour the past year. Nowadays the pakjesavond gets shifted towards the weekend, but that was no item for this year, it was on Sunday-evening.
Several years ago already Sinterklaas got serious competition of Santa Claus, and many people have now stopped the Sinterklaas-rituals. It is a pity. But if you still believe in him, as I do, you will never forget to celebrate his birthday...
In one of the coming days, I will post a message with more details about Sinterklaas, as his age and the place where he lives, but i will have to ask my mother, she will know that, and I see her tomorrow.

I hope to have told our BT'ers a bit more about this very old western-european habit.
In the Netherlands the zwarte Pieten are painted black, but on Bonaire this is a bit different; there they paint Sinterklaas white....... There are more differences, because where on Bonaire you will find a chimney or a central-heating radiator?


Harrie

Harrie, what a wonderful story. I put my slippers out last night, but it rained all night and now they are just soaking wet...no presents in them I must have been a very naughty girl the last 12 months...LOL!

Cynde, I haven't received any presents in years, I'm always bad. I have a nice coal collection LOL!

Thank you Harrie and Martin, and all who explained the shoes near the chimneys.

I wonder if our tradition of hanging our stockings on the mantle above the fireplace is a adaption of the Dutch putting shoes near the fireplace...

We crazy Americans take from other cultures, mix it around to suit our tastes, call it our own, and then broadcast it world wide.

Here is Quinn this morning. The paper was much more fun.

Well, I lined up ALL my shoes, about 200 pairs of them, and got nothing. Maybe I'm being greedy? LOL

I told Steve just because he has big feet doesn't mean he gets a bigger present... but today is his birthday!

So his B'day is the same as Sint Nicolaas...

Congratulations Steve!

A short update on Sinterklaas, as promised.

Sinterklaas was a Bishop of the greek-catholic church in a place called Myra, in small-Asia, (nowadays Turkey). He lived and worked in small-ASIA. Because of trade with Italy, he also visited Italy. Spain owned Italy at that time partially. Spain was in that time a rich country, where lots of luxurious goods and sweets came from. That is the reason people thought that Sint Nicolaas came from Spain himself. Sint Nicolas was born in the year 270, so he is 1734 years of age, at the moment.
He rides on a white horse. Those times VIPs felt a white horse gave them importancy, so they liked to ride on white horses. Wodan, the German God, used a white horse too.
Sint Nicolaas does not want to be seen, so that is the reason he brings all the presents and sweets in the dark, through the chimneys. The above-mentioned god Wodan contacted the people in the same way. You could say Wodan inspired Sinterklaas to do the same way.

Although Sinterklaas was born in 270, the rituals around him originate from the 16th century, or perhaps a little earlier. Zwarte Piet is dressed in the page-dresses of that time. Pages were the personal servants of high-important persons, like dukes and princes. So the dress of zwarte Piet is actually the dress of personal servants of VIPs from the 16th century.

One thing for sure, as the originating history of Sinterklaas goes back to the 16th century, and probably earlier, the American Santa Claus must be a copy of "our" Sinterklaas. So let's say, the Americans were the Japanese of the Middle Ages! But they did their copy-work quite good, because Santa seems to have conquered Sinterklaas finally.....

Any reactions? Probably!

Harrie

Well, Santa comes from NYC, a former Dutch Colony, and was first drawn by a famous political cartoonist Thomas Nast for Harpers Weekly.
NYers also invented the commercialization of christmas, the alcoholization of St. Patricks day, baseball,the Broadway musical,and xerox copying.

Hi Seb, nice addition, do you also know when Santa was drawn the first time?

Harrie

Hi Harrie,

that would be in the year 1862 at Christmas. Santa was not the very jolly CocaCola Santa of today, but more concerned with the bad effects of the civil war on the Union forces and families. Here's the link:

http://cartoons.osu.edu/nast/santa_camp.htm

Of course, there is always competing information:

http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/santa.asp

See you at Gibis a week from Tuesday Harrie?

Wow, Seb and Harrie, makes very interesting reading. Thanks for the links, Seb.

Hi Seb,

No Gibis for me anymore, too many people all speaking american, and I miss all the clues, wasn't worth for me, my american is too bad. If you want to meet me, make an appointment, and/or visit me at my place (old neighbour of Jake&Linda), or perhaps we meet on 1st januari-party at Jake&Linda.