What are some other sites that would be good for night diving besides the town pier?

try salt pier, it is one of our favorites and easy entry and exit. just dont do it when there is a ship there.

Actually, you now (and have for the last couple of years) needed permission from the Bonaire Harbourmaster to dive the Salt Pier - your Bonaire dive shop can request that permission for you.

I had a recent late afternoon dive at Tori's Reef turn into a night dive (our air consumption was really good :-) ) and really enjoyed checking out all the critters in the sandy area at twilight.

Jake

I think the Hilma Hooker is one of the best night dives of Bonaire. Sometimes the suface swim out can be just as beautiful as the dive.Last May the bioluminescence was so strong every fin kick created an explosion of neon green and the moonless night sky was so clear you could see the Milky Way. We swam out without lights. When we got to the stern downline, I grabbed it gave it a big swing back and forth and it lit up like a lightening bolt all the way down to the wreck. I was awed by the beauty. Many intersting creatures come out at night on the wreck that you won't see during the day. Orange cup coral covers big chunks of the wreck and make a night dive on the Hooker an unforgettable experience. Cruise the holds at night and look sharp- no telling what you'll see! I saw a many-toothed Conger there on my last nocturnal vist. That was a first for me. I hope I'm fortunate enough to make this dive many more times.

Isn't the Hilma Hooker a bit deep for a night dive? Unless of course you haven't done any diving that day.

It's the same depth night or day Always dive within the limits of your training, equipment, comfort and nitrogen/oxygen status.

Which means what Bruce? As you are obviously aware, Gail (an Advanced Open Water Diver) was pointing out (and correctly so) the Hilma Hooker is not a "recommended" repetitive dive unless your earlier dives have been to that depth or deeper or you have lowered your nitrogen loading to an acceptable level.

This is not a technical diving or discussion forum, it a discussion group for the enjoyment of Bonaire.

I'm not sure what I did to deserve that flame, but that's OK. I thought we were talking about cool night dives. I think the Hilma Hooker is a great night dive, not a technical dive at all. What did I write that made you so angry Kelly? I'm here to have fun like everyone else.

Bruce,

I have also night dived the Hooker....and you are absolutely right - it's a FANTASTIC night dive.

One can see so far into the engine room and it was that that got my curiosity up, so I went to Linda at Caribe Inn and got my wreck specialty.

I now have explored the innards of the Hooker and it was so cool. I don't think it's safe anymore and for a certainty, no one should penetrate unless 1) specialty certified 2) use lines 3) check with locals about the safety (there was a lot of debris falling inside).

Warning: If you do penetrate (following steps 1-3) if you encounter any air pockets, do not go up.....there's oil on the surface...just ask Linda, she took days to get the oil out of hair

kelly,

on a clear night with enough moonlight a dive at the hooker to a maximum of 60 ft is also very impressive if you dive to the wreck from shore (not swimming out..). you can go around the wreck at that depth and if you dont use your lights and let the moonlight do the whole show its fantastic...and a bit spooky, too
and, it's acceptable as a repetitive dive that way

Acceptable dive ?!?!?!? That is what the two new divers thought when they dove Pink Beach, they never did recover their bodies. That is a little strong but my point is the Hilma Hooker can be an advanced dive day or night. I do not want new or divers with limited experience to read this and say "Let's Go Do A Night Dive" !!!

Enough moonlight and limiting your dive to 60 fsw are fine, but what happens if clouds obscure the moonlight, the Hooker is only 100 meters long and that makes it a very small target on a large reef system. My point is if we recommend this as a "fun" dive, we should make sure everybody is aware that without a compass and the skill to use it and at least two lights this dive can be potentially hazardous.

I seem to recall reading recently (either a DAN article or in my PADI magazine) that the whole issue of reverse profiles (i.e. diving deeper on later dives in the day) doesn't adversely or statistically affect the likelihood of get DCS. So Bruce's comment about oxygen/nitrox profiles being what you have to keep your eye on would seem to be in line with that, even if the night dive is your deepest dive of the day.

That said, I'd only recommend doing the Hilma Hooker as a night dive with an experienced night diver (divemaster, etc.), because of its location.

Jake

Kelly,

Make that three lights minimum - it's not a short swim back to shore, and trust me, navigating the waters in a boat for a dive at the Hooker at night without a full moon present is also a major challenge (thankfully there is a gadget called a GPS which can help out in such situations ).

Jake

Hey Jake, three lights (one primary and two back-ups) certainly increase my comfort level.

Jake,
I know the articles you are referring to.. I was not really impressed with nature of the "study" as it was more based on a limited observation study then imperical/statisical analysis...(i.e. "x" number of professional level divers. etc)... but I do know that several of the techncial agencies are rethinking FOR COMPUTER ASSISTED DIVING CURRENT ALGORTHIMS. Honest truth.. I have been doing reverse profiles for years, although as a practice I try to avoid them..

Personally, speaking as a fairly experienced diver, I see absolutely nothing wrong with the Hooker as a night dive for appropriately trained/experienced divers...after all at least one agency has a specialty called Limited Visibility/Night Diving.. and where I dive up north has far less viz during the day then the hooker at night would. As far as surface navigation... gee guys there is a radio mast with aircraft lights there.. if you can't find the beach.. welllllll...My biggest concern would be trying to make it back to the beach through the shallow water coral...

. Now I would be concerned about car on shore at night.. I would make sure that I had nothing in it... As far as depth...hey its 90 in the sand... It up to each and evry diver to figure out what their daily profile is.. It might be someones first dive of the day.. it also might be there umpteenth...

remember freedom carries responsibilites... just because a diver is lost doesn't mean the whole sport or practice is unsafe or wrong...its just a wake up call for proper planning, keeping experience up and for diving within your limits..

oooopppp sorry about that soap box...bad box bad...



re

If Transworld Radio is still transmitting, you have a back up of 5 lights (high up on the towers) - all towards the shore and they have generators to provide power to their lights, in the event of a WEB power outage.

I agree that the potential for an accident on the Hooker are present. It is not, in my opinion a very difficult dive - IF YOU ARE EXPERIENCED. For you inexperienced - as Jake said, divemaster or above if this is to be a night dive.

I would also recommend if you are experienced, you would of course do a day dive first, wouldn't you?

Oh, the two that were lost at Pink Beach? If my memory serves me, I think they had 16 dives between them according to their divelogs - now that is just plain stupidity and asking for an accident to happen.

Barry, I am not sure what you are saying. I think I agree with your overall statement. I too do not view The hooker is not a very difficult dive. It is an advanced dive (as I believe generally any dive above 60 feet is classifed). I certainly agree with diving in first during the day... as I would recommend doing that with any night dive site). As far as equating Divemaster and above as being definition of experienced or special qual for diving her at night.. naaaahh... DM and above are professional rating aimed at education/training. There are large number of divers out there who have great diving skills and abilities who are NOT DM's and above...and there are DMs and above who I would say lack these same skills and abilities.
and my memory on what I understand of the pink beach accident is the same but again I wouldn't go so far as to say there were an accident waiting to happen...by some standards one of them could have been classified as an AOW..

Jason, I have found what you say is absolutely correct about the DM subject. And, I agree that there are experienced OWs that just don't want to go beyond Putting Another Dollar In (PADI), so remained at that OW level and have a hugh amount of experience. They know their abilities and would have no problem on the Hooker.

My reference to DM was for those with less experience and knowledge. Also, as a responsible DM, I have to really say that.

The two at PB....one had 4-6 dives, the other about 12 if my memory serves me correctly. By any standard, they should NOT have been doing a night dive together without supervision, for surely they did not have the training under any standard. That IS an accident waiting to happen.

And as stated earlier, I was one of many in the search for them. As you search in 180+ feet of water and scan the bottom for a dive belt, mask, fin, or worst yet, a body, you do a lot of thinking and my thinking was: WHY? Where did they get their instruction from? How tragic for something like this to happen in such a safe sport.

Barry, Thanks for the clarification. I am in total agreementon the idea of dive leaders for those desiring additional experience... I try avoid the agency issues...(oh OK so give me a couple of drinks and..).. but unfortunately there are ones out there that could have given at least one of those two a c-card that would have given them impression they were qualified.. fun huh?? For those reading this exchange.who might be in the early phase of their diving.. I strongly encourage the use of dive leaders..takes a lot of the hassales out of the learning/experience process...as always pleasant chatting with 'ya.. got to see about losing this darn soap box that keeps popping up...

I don't think that the Hooker should be ruled out for night dives. By The Way has
anyone out there ever heard of a compass. They even work in the dark so if WEB goes
down and Trans Worlds generator DIES gee shore is to the east! Diving the exterior of
the Hooker is not a technical dive and is done on a daily basis by probably 50+ divers a
day, more on the days the dive boats show up. Speaking from Ten years experience
supervising divers on Bonaire I can tell you that reverse profiles are done by a large
number of divers daily with no adverse effects. Do I do reverse profiles? Yes. Would I
do radical reverse profiles? No. Do I try to avoid them? No. Do I think they Greatly
increase the chances of a Hit? No, as long as no other predisposing factors are present.
How many Instructors out there do reverse profiles every training weekend?

Three lights per person in a buddy team seems a little excessive. You would think that
the standard two per person would be more than adequate for none penetration dives.
Carry as many as you are comfortable with but bare in mind that the more crap you
hang all over your body the more possible problems you create for yourself. More drag,
more entanglement possibilities, carry what you need and NO more. We are not talking
about Technical penetration dives here we are talking about a nice relaxing night dive.

Sorry this was going to be a short piece in support of Bruce's opinion. But I firmly
believe in the Armstrong Opinion and Diving Freedom!!!

Walt... compass??? Isn't that a device that a device for drawing circles??? Being a diver whose habit is still subsidized by a dive shop...I strongly recommend that all night divers equip them selves with as many mights as possible.. in fact if you go for three or four rechargables you can actually take weights off your belt.....

but seriousily you and Bruce and Barry make excellent points...as far as reverse profiles and instructors....OK very valid point .. in fact I would safely say the ONLY time I don't do reverse profiles is when I am doing recreational dives..hmmmm never mind...OK I still would recommend that if you are diving tables.. (shudder).. then I would not recommend reverse profiles...

damn I really have to do something about that stupid soap box today...

Tables? I thought people sat around tables. Set drinks on tables. I don't know too many poeple that dive by tables

Jason

Oh you mean those pieces of paper that my printer spits out after I plan the dive on
Voyager Dive Planing software. So I can write it on duct tape and stick it on my fins.
Yes it is much easier to read at that size and distance. Writing it on my slate is only a
back up in case I loose both my fins. Yes you heard it here first another use for Duct
tape!

Hey, guys,

There are so many signs of land direction at the Hooker!! She lies still on the bottom with her bottom pointed to land, then travelling straight up that slope is 'to shore'.

It will a very dark night in diving weather that the beach and the breaking water cannot be seen in ambient light; even the land looms in the island direction and not offshore. A dive light will highlight the beach and surf on any divable night. If the local lights are out there is always Kralendijk -- though, of course, the whole island does sometimes go dark, doesn't it? Back, then, to the loom.

It is very correct and proper to be conservstive but divers must also use their good common sense and all life experiences and not just keep their heads in an instructional agency book.

I often dive by tables . there at least two tables at both Windsock (one with fire ants) and Bachlor Beach..

Hmmm between this and the Windjammer thread I would guess it's been a slow weekend for y'all.

Kelly

A slow Saturday morning only. 3 dives to do today

Walt, awwwwww you are simple breaking my heart (I am headed back to the pool with a class of 7, Modules 3,4 & 5. You have my deepest sympathies ... NOT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kelly.. stuck in store on Saturday.. for some reason there has been a rush on dive lights... then Three dive Sunday morning...still 38 at 90.. then back to store.for first lecture in rebreather...soooo..

Jay, don't forget Jake and I get our cut on the dive lights!!!

As to 38 F at 90, are you NUTZ !?!?!??! When in the Gulf it was 71 at 115 and I was whining !!! Knowing you your drysuit was probable leaking as well. Remember diving is FUN !!!!!!

OH Gee, should I have posted a "Thread Drift" notice ?????