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Trip Reports: Gail's Addendum
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Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gail Thomas on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 9:24 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Addendum:

I mentioned to my husband that I had finally posted our trip report, and he asked if I wrote about my “episode”. I said no, that I didn’t need everyone to know about my “episode”! But since coming back home, he had talked to a very qualified, experienced diver who had a similar episode, and who briefly felt the same as I. John, my “lord and master”, or so he calls himself, thinks my story may help someone else…. So here goes:

It was only my 4th dive on the trip. We had dove Rappel for our first dive that day, and then decided to do a simple shore dive off the dock of the Black Durgon. John and our 2 friends, wanted to drop down to at least 100 feet because they were planning to dive the Hilmer Hooker that afternoon. I wasn’t planning to dive the Hooker, so I told them I’d hang out around 60 feet waiting for them to return. They came back up and we settled into our usual dive pattern, M, V, myself, and John. (I don’t like to name other people on postings without their permission)

We were right at 60 feet, and I was just floating along, inhaled, exhaled, and then sucked in a major mouthful of salt water. I went upright and initially stayed calm. I saw my regulator floating away from me, pulled it back, purged it, saw I had plenty of air, and then realized that the mouth piece was missing. I still was fairly calm, and started groping for my octopus. I had my octo clipped to a low D ring on the bottom of my BCD, and my BC pockets were full of water and very puffy, and I couldn’t grasp my octo. I looked around for John but couldn’t see him. This was one time when I didn’t bother to strap on my knife, so I had nothing to signal him with. I then was getting kind of wild eyed. I still couldn’t grasp my octo. Since I had exhaled and had no air in my lungs, I started inhaling, and of course just sucked in more water. I did this twice, instinctively, even though I consciencely tried not to breathe. At this point, the thought came that this was going to be “IT”, and all of a sudden John appeared at my side. He had been about 10 feet higher than me, which is why I hadn’t seen him. He grabbed my regulator and tried to shove it back into my mouth. I pointed to the open end, to indicate that the mouth piece was gone. He then tried to shove his octopus into my mouth but was purging it as it was coming at me, and by that point I was panicing and shoved it away. He then shoved his own regulator into my mouth, purged it, and I got a blessed lungful of air.

At this point all I wanted was to get out of the *&^%*@@* water! I started kicking upwards, and John was pulling me back down. All I could think of was that I had his regulator, and he had no air, so I tried to give him his reg back. He waved me off, so I kicked to the surface as he’s holding me back, and I grabbed his hair to pull him up..... not realizing that he was using his octopus. I inflated my BC, he deflated it.... I’m kicking upwards and he’s slowing me down..... but we finally broke surface, about 30 feet from a boat that had just tied up to the Small Wall mooring. I was gasping for real air, totally exhausted, and still wanted out of the water. The people on the boat got a bit of a show as I gasped “Help me” and John waved them off! He said look to your right, and our friend M was there. He’s a highly experienced diver at the instructor level, but was using his rescue diver skills to assess the situation. John told him what happened and he determined that I was pretty much OK, and decided that he and John would tow me back to the dock, which is at most a 5 minute swim, but seemed like an eternity to me. They both talked to me the whole way back, continuing to assure me that I was fine, and by the time we reached the dock, I was able to climb the ladder under my own power. My computer indicated the dive only lasted 7 minutes, so my whole episode could only have been 2 minutes at best. That was the longest 2 minutes of my life!

So I’m still here! It just wasn’t my time! Of course my husband relishes, in fun, telling everyone how he saved my life.... and I guess he really did. Why am I writing this to tell the world of my humbling episode.....? because of what I learned, and because it just may help someone else one day.

My octopus is now clipped to a D ring on my chest. I can see it and touch it continually during every dive. John checked his regulator, and pulled the mouth piece off with a simple wiggle. We had just had our gear serviced prior to our trip, and suspect that they may have removed the mouth pieces, and put them back on too loose. Always check and inspect your gear when you get it back from servicing. And have a signaling device, be it knife, tank hammer, or whatever.

When we got back John talked to his coworker about this, who just happens to be a very experienced diver. Even with all of this experience John’s friend has, he admitted to a similar feeling of panic due to a failed diaphram in his reg. His friend said it can be a very frightening experience, even for a seasoned diver. It is more difficult to stay calm once you have completely exhaled than when you practice switching regs while holding your breath. I have 80+ dives and don’t consider myself a novice, but I’m not a real pro either, so I felt much better knowing that a very experienced and highly trained diver shared my initial reaction.

.... this is John. Confessions- I believe I made three serious mistakes. Here are my confessions.
1) I should not have left my dive buddy at 60 ft and taken off to the bottom. Even if it was only for a couple of minutes.
2) I should not have assumed her regulator got “knocked” out of her mouth and she simple could not find it. Rather I should have assumed something was wrong with her gear and immediately given her my octopus.
3) I should not have purge my octopus as I was giving it to her, the additional bubbles only confused the situation.
Although the situation was quickly over, at the time it was forever. In contradiction my brain was thrown in to overdrive and all of my training ran through my brain at light speed. In retrospective I think back to what M said, “that which does not kill you will make you stronger”. I truly believe Gail will become a better diver because of this incident. Who knows, one day she may get to return the favor to her “Lord & Master” :) John

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By mary pequinot on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 9:39 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

What a story! During my first TEST dive, where I had top signal "out of air" and then receive the reg from the instructor, I put it in my mouth and also got a mouth of saltwater. It happened again, and suddenly my instructor was shoving my regulator at me. I took it, purged, everything was fine. When we surfaced, she showed me the mouthpiece had come off, and said I did SUCH a good job not panicking. That was because I didn't know what was happening and didn't have time to panic-I just reacted mechanically.

I've had a couple of other weird things happen as well, but one thing's for sure-when you make a mistake diving, you really learn from that mistake and don't make it again. Thank God everyone was ok, and it worked out. It must have been a very frightening experience for both of you-thanks for sharing it.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By scott and sharon barlass on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 9:54 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Gail,

Congratulations on going on more dives after this incident! Some people would have quit diving. I'll bet you practice grabbing that octo from time to time now that it is in a more accessible location! Thanks for sharing this story. I'm sure it will help everyone think about being prepared.

Scott

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By seb schulherr on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 10:08 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I have heard of this problem before. I like to think that if I were involved in a similar situation I would simply grab the regulator and breathe through it, the loss of the mouthpiece only affects the comfort level, not the functionality. We were taught to breathe from a free flowing regulator in training, this may make me more inclined to this course of action.
And not for nothin, I use my octopus regularly, making sure I have "muscle memory" as to exactly where it is. I use a modified scubapro holder on an air 2, so the4re is no unclipping, I pull and the octo comes free. I even like to practice taking off my bc entirely and putting it back on. Skills learnt years ago and unpracticed are skills lost.
just my 2cents, I am delighted you shared your experience with us all, maybe it will make ALL of us better divers.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Leif S on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 10:47 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Certification training is for situations just like that. Glad to hear that a tragedy was avoided. These things happen, but hopefully not often.

Back in June, at the end of my dive from Angel City to Hilma Hooker and back, my air gauge failed at 30ft, reading 1000psi when I was, in fact, completely out of air - and this was new gear with just 8 dives logged on it! It is actually quite surprising how long you can go after exhaling normally before taking your next breath. Most people can easily, if they try, wait longer than 15 seconds before their body demands an inhale. Underwater it can be even a little longer. When deflated your lungs still have air in them, and at depth even more air is present due to compression, so there is even more unused O2 in the air in your lungs than you realize.

During the O/W certification course one of the drills is an "out of air" drill. My instructor, a dutch fellow, proved the point during that drill. He had us wait to give the signal until we both knew our air was turned off and also absolutely felt we needed a breath. By remaining very calm I discovered that the reserve air in my lungs can sustain me for better than 30 seconds when needed.

Like you, on this past trip I found I had a REAL out-of-air situation, but I focused on staying calm. I approached my buddy (she was swimming away in front me, so I came up behind her), detached her octo and gave her a signal as she turned around. She seemed more anxious then me, so I ended up reassuring her. I explained the problem with more signals and demonstrated it to convince her. (When you purge both your main and octo and nothing comes out, its pretty obvious that you are not just kidding around.) Rather than go into an emergency ascent, we checked her air supply and mutually decided to continue the dive (just another 5-10 minutes in to shore, slowly up the slope) on her remaining air - even though she was already under 500; but hey, that's why you should end dives with some reserve in the tank. Swimming in close formation, we saw some great extra fish, squid and coral in that last 5 minutes.

The point is that if you remember your training and apply it, you should not ever find yourself in a panic at depth again.

I was thankful that my wife made us both re-read our basic O/W certification books on the plane on our way to the island, and it sure helped to remind us of things like this:

1. Always mount your octo using something that releases with just a tug, and place it in the triangle formed by the bottom corners of your lungs and the top center point below your chin, both so you can grab it with your eyes closed and so your buddy can grab it too.
2. Use hand signals like "out of air," "slow down," "stay at this level", etc.
3. Assess first, then give the aid that is needed. (If your buddy had just handed you your octo, that may have been all you needed, and you might have been able to continue the dive.)

Most importantly, remain calm... I'll bet you could have still breathed from your gimped main regulator, since it sounds like just the mouthpiece had fallen off.

Finally, "trust noone, except maybe your dive buddy." I personally inspect my gear even after getting it tested, just as I personally ensure that my parachute is packed right. It's easier to be careless when it won't be your own life on the line!

Still, glad everything turned out OK for you in the end.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ida Christie on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 11:31 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks for telling your story. I had a panic attack at 90 feet. Scuba diving has it's lessons and some are hard lessons to learn.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gary larabee on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 12:53 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

gail,
it was you. i think you hit the water the very next day didn't you? really glad everything worked out ok. i think you gave al a start.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gail Thomas on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 1:11 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Yep, that was me! I went back in that afternoon, or I may have never again! But I sure learned a lot!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Glen Reem on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 2:23 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Some observations.

In years past, regulator mouthpieces were glued on using wet suit glue and then a tie was applied. Helps prevent accidental mouthpiece loss.

I always add a second tie to my mouthpieces, a thin one if there isn't room for the 'standard' size used by dive shops. The thin one will keep the mouthpiece on if the regular tie breaks. And I know I tightened it. 'A little prevention...'

My Bonaire daughter had her mouthpiece come off on a 'Try Scuba' dive. Put the regulator in her mouth and breathed while she turned to the instructor. Bug eyes and an immediate trip to the surface. But, as someone said above, the regulator still works fine without the mouthpiece. And a few toothmarks in the metal don't hinder the new mouthpiece seal. :–)

And, of course, we all should check gear when anyone else has been mucking with it, a dive shop or anyone. Final responsibility lies with each of us. I recently didn't do that and found that the shop had put a regular mouthpiece on my Sherwood Ultima (that takes work-- the Ultima air tube is significantly larger than most bottom exhaust regs-- the person had to know what he was doing). They didn't give me back all the parts they had replaced and I paid an unitemized bill. Shame on both of us.

TKS for sharing, Gail.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By DARLENE ELLIS on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 2:45 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Gail, I am so glad that you are OK. That must have been a very fightening experience for you. I was very glad to hear that you were able to go right back in after such an experience!! What a gal!!!! YOU GO GIRL!!!!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Carole Baker on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 5:12 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Pretty scary stuff, Gail! We are certainly glad it all worked out for you. How frightening that must have been. A lesson learned, indeed. Whew...scares me just reading your description! Carole

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Snorkelguy {Scott} on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 6:18 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Gail,

Thanks for sharing this I applaud your honesty and your ability to turn this into a life lesson.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By JIM KENNEDY on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 7:25 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Since becoming technical certified I now wear my octo around my neck with tubing whenever I dive. It can be dark as hell and I KNOW where it's at, I can feel it there. After many out of air drills; faulty primary stages drills; manifold isolation drills and gas switching nothing seems to upset me anymore. When not diving in doubles I always dive with a pony bottle. As the boy scouts say "Be Prepared" and expect the unexpected. Although there was one time that I ran out of air in a swimming pool while trying my drysuit for the first time. No air to breath and no air for the drysuit or the BCD. And I forgot to dump my weights, thank God my dive instructor who was teaching a underwater class seen me and I signal out of air! The students thought it was part of the class instructions!

Jimini

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By seb schulherr on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 7:49 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

There are mouthpiece tie wraps available with a curved lock for mouthpieces which seem a bit more secure. I also usually put the tie wrap in hot water and then put it on so it will tighten up when it cools down.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cecil Berry on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 7:50 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Great story Gail, thanks for sharing. You've made me rethink my secondary. It's presently in a pocket, not ever again. I have a necklace for it, my dive buddy brought it for me (Geeze, I wonder if there's a message).

In fact speaking of dummy moves. The first dive Sunday, it seemed my regulator was hard to breath through. On the second dive just as we were going to descend, I noticed I had my regulators switched and used my secondary on the first dive, duh. There I was on the surface and had to switch regulators, the theory was that the pocket had pull away velcro so all you had to do was pull the hose. I pulled and pulled on that hose, no regulator. I finally found one of the velcro flaps and ripped it open for the regulator. Thank God I was not at depth and needed that regulator.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Susan Taft on Monday, July 29, 2002 - 8:51 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Gail and John, Thanks for sharing not only your "episode" but what you learned from it. I am glad that all ended well! We had a scare on a recent dive trip in the Keys --- one that even scared my sister, an instructor/rescue diver --- and when we reflected on it after were able to see what we might have done differently. And like you, the best thing was to get right back in the water! Again, thanks for sharing and glad all ended well.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mercy Baron on Tuesday, July 30, 2002 - 1:22 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Gail, I don't even know what an octopus is execept the kind I see when I go snorkeling, but I'm so glad is wasn't your time yet...because I haven't even met you yet! I just got back Sat night from my virgin trip to Bon and haven't had time to write a trip report so far, but will soon!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Faith M. Senie on Tuesday, July 30, 2002 - 7:48 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Gail, thanks for posting that -- it must have taken a lot of guts to write it. But John is right -- it's a good lesson for us all. It also lets us unburden ourselves over similar issues... :)

Dan and I did a dive on July 4th that was our deepest yet up here in New England at just around 100 feet (boat dive, bottom started at around 85 and went down to at least 130). We were running nitrox, around 31% mix (good to at least 110 feet). Gorgeous dive, saw all kinds of life, good vis. I don't remember how much air was in my tank when we started for the surface, but as we're ascending, I'm watching the numbers drop faster than I think I"m rising, and I start to panic at about 50 feet, thinking I'm going to run out of air before we get to the surface. The last time I had a panic attack that bad was during my pool training! There was no way I could explain all this to Dan via hand signals, so I started running through my mind all the dive physiology stuff we learned in our training -- breaths take more air at depth; the shallower I get, the less air I'll be taking per breath; the more I panic the more air I'll take in, so I need to do deep, calm breaths... I start doing nice deep, long yoga breaths to relax myself (along with lots of mental "relax!" orders to myself), and we make it up to the 15 foot safety stop with my tank having enough air for a decent safety stop and then some. But by this point I was a wreck, so I asked Dan to make it a 3 minute stop instead of the 5 minute one he wanted...

Lessons learned? 1) Never do a deep dive on a small tank! Dan was running with 85's, but I was using a 66. When we did the same site a week or so later, I did it on an 85, and was fine. 2) Time to consider a pony bottle! If we're going to be doing deep dives like that, it's worth having an extra bottle of air with us down there. We're looking at a 19 right now. 3) just because my air is running low doesn't mean my buddy is just as low! Turns out Dan had enough air to share and still get us to the surface with a good safety margin. I just automatically assumed he'd have less than me, and didn't check with him. 4) plan ahead of time! On the next trip to that site, we decided before we got in the water what air level we would start for the surface with. THat really helped with the enjoyment the second time out.

Gail, thanks for giving me an opening to get that off my chest... :) And I'm glad you made it through your incident! I learned to check out my gear after a servicing after our service guy put my SeaCure mouthpiece on upside-down after the last round. Couldn't figure out why my customized mouthpiece didn't fit right anymore, and why my jaw was so achy. Then on a whim, I flipped my regulator over (on land) and tried it again -- fit like a glove... :) We gave the guy some goodnatured grief about it, but it was a good lesson for us...

Faith

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gail Thomas on Wednesday, July 31, 2002 - 2:36 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I’d like to thank everyone for such kind and supporting comments! It was somewhat embarrassing to admit so much of my training had flown out of my head, but I am human and do make mistakes. And most importantly, I gained some valuable experience from it. Again, thanks for the kind words and extra safety tips! Safe diving to all! Gail

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Karl H on Wednesday, July 31, 2002 - 9:37 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I am coming in late on this thread, but agree that sharing experiences like these is a good learning experience for us all. I had my own share of scares, which taught me that what we learn in our basic training takes on a new perspective in real dive situations.

My first one came off the coast of Saba: on my last qualifying OW dive at 45 feet, the instructor ask me to take off my mask. Guess what? The mask strap broke! With the classroom lessons fresh in my mind, I calmly placed the mask blindly back on my face, held it there, cleared it, grabbed the instructor's arm, and we made it to the surface without panic and even did our safety stop. Needless to say I passed.

Last February, in the Bahamas: the mooring line of our liveaboard (Aquacat) broke in rough sea. When we surfaced, the boat was "miles" away. Air left in tank 450 psi and no snorkel! (I hate taking one.) Got a little panicky on the swim back until the crew noticed me and a dinghy picked me up. Lesson learned? Never again dive without a snorkel, no matter how much of a nuisance.

On the next dive, the stress from the no-snorkel and no-dive-boat experience, must have carried over to my next dive when I found out that one can actually "overbreathe" one's regulator. The anxiety from the previous dive triggered more fears and, without realizing it at first, I was sucking air like crazy on my descent. The rescue diver slogan, stop, breathe (slowly), think, and act, got me out of that panic situation and I finished the dive.

So, what at times in the theorical classroom environment does not hit home, sure does when we get into these open water situations.

Thank you, Gail, for starting this thread, with the encouragement of your husband. Very helpful.

Karl H.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ronald Sylvester on Thursday, August 1, 2002 - 1:33 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Gail
Your experience brought back to memory a similar experience about 12 years ago, diving in the Florida Keys. Just about ready to end a dive under the boat in about 20 feet of water. I observed my wife swiming towards me motioning to her mouth. I say mouth because the regulator was hanging at her side. She had taken a couple of breaths of water and still had the rubber mouthpiece in her mouth. I gave her my regulator to breath, she took a couple of breaths and then decided to free ascend to the surface. Scared the heck out of me. On board the boat she said she felt congested when she breathed. Of course my concern was a air embolism even though she stated she exhaled all the way to the surface. Her ascent was at a slow rate also. Ended up in a local hospital where they ruled out a empolism but put her in intensive care for a day because of the saltwater in her lungs. I believe antibiotics were administered because of the danger of bacteria in the seawater. Released as I remember after a couple of days.
Your story is the first i have read of this type of incident and obviously from the responses, happens quite often. Probably should be mentioned in training classes.
Glad everything worked out for the best.

 


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