By Stephen Tise (BonaireTalker - Post #100) on Friday, December 17, 2010 - 11:38 am: |
Bonaire has great reason to be proud of their kids who against great odds represent the island well in the world of Windsurfing. Unfortunately as many know windsurfing has been challenged by the new and ever growing sport of Kitesurfing. Windsurfing and specifically pro-windsurfing has dwindled considerably. Many people who use to windsurf have now gone to kiting, as has there dollars. If you have an interest that goes beyond the status quo at Lac please join the conversation in the Kitesurfing, Windsurfing thread. It seems people there think they speak for the all the people on the island. The continued ban on kiting at Lac has hurt the local economy, it no doubt has hurt the potential for the children to participate in fastest growing watersport. The reality is that kiting at Pink beach is less than ideal and potentially very dangerous. Why the island continues to let people who serve only their own interest represent the island is beyond me. If you wan't to support the Children of the Wind, there future is only enhanced by the Kiteboardings inclusion at Lac. The days of denial are over, can you afford to let the NIMBY politics speak for you? If you have both social and an economic interests in your community you can't afford to let these people dominate the discussion. Please, if you would support a temporary lift on the prohibition at Lac and wan't to explore the real economic realities while at the same time support the future of the 'Children of the wind' please speak. There is a solution at Lac that can serve all interest. The first step is a temporary lifting of the ban, implement rules and a strategy that serves all interests. After a probationary period you folks can decide to continue or not. What harm is there in investigating the potential of a environmentally sound sport that would help the economic realities we struggle with while also serving the potential future of the 'Children of the Wind'
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By KOB (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #341) on Friday, December 17, 2010 - 12:05 pm: |
Mods ... are we going to let this subject spill over into every thread on BT ?? Isn't the Kiteboarding, Windsurfing ... thread the right place ??
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By Freddie................someoneisawizeass (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #15350) on Friday, December 17, 2010 - 12:44 pm: |
KOB, this is OK too.. just not duplicate posts. Stephen should really do an article for the Reporter to get attention if he really wants it....and keep it off this board.
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By Stephen Tise (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #103) on Friday, December 17, 2010 - 3:50 pm: |
This is about a lot more than kitesurfing and windsurfing. This is about the community. I don't think a shop owner cares if its kiteboarder or windsurfer who buys, the condo owner doesn’t care if its a windsurfer or kiter who rents. How many non kiters/windsurfers actually read the kiteboarding/windsurfing thread. The reality is this is likely a better forum thread than where it originated. Lac is simply a resource for all the islands residents whether they use it or not. KOB, is trying to control the conversation. KOB, you should simply examine your conscience. The island of Bonaire relies on tourism, and the conversation that promotes tourism is the one we are having. It is arrogant to suggest that kiteboarding be relegated as a fringe element. I’m a father of two; I’m close to fifty years old. I don’t come to Bonaire because I can’t kite there safely. My family who windsurfs can’t come as a consequence. If you alienate a kiter you will alienate a family or a group, this is the situation. People, this is as serious as a heart attack. If you want to rent, sell, or service more, participate in this conversation or others will speak for you.
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By Freddie................someoneisawizeass (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #15351) on Friday, December 17, 2010 - 4:34 pm: |
Stephen I find your posts very hard to read..
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By KOB (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #342) on Friday, December 17, 2010 - 10:07 pm: |
Stephen -- examine my conscience? I voted with my $$ and bought a home on Bonaire where I will be retiring. Helped STINAPA raise money to buy binoculars for the kids of Bonaire. I am neutral regarding kiting, just don't want to be bludgeoned on every thread by one person's views.
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By Jerry (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #30149) on Friday, December 17, 2010 - 10:18 pm: |
Stephen, this is getting old fast.
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By Brian ******* (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4814) on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 4:36 am: |
this guy is a troll farting in public.
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By Freddie................someoneisawizeass (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #15352) on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 6:03 am: |
and you just fed him..... shame on you Brian
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By Ruth van Tilburg (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1435) on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 11:45 am: |
Yep. I'm here. Personally, I don't see why the kiters couldn't set up shop on the other side, the Lac Cai side, across from Sorobon/Jibe (not near the mangroves, more in the fisherman's channel area near the old piles of conch shells). There's already a local business established there that could cater to food/drink needs; this would be a boost for them, because now they're just there on Sundays, or they could rent it to someone to run the other days. If the kiters were over there, they could still enjoy the benefits of lac, and they would not be in a position to be buzzing any surfacing divers. If my arms/shoulders weren't so screwed up, I'd be kiting myself--I watch them at Atlantis sometimes, and they look like they're having fantastic fun.
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By Anouk (BonaireTalker - Post #15) on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 11:55 am: |
What do you mean no divers there???? That is the entrance for the Cai Shoredive....
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By Jerry (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #30155) on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 12:32 pm: |
Anouk is correct.
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By Ruth van Tilburg (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1436) on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 1:06 pm: |
Yes, I know it's the entrance for the Cai/east side shore divers, but it's really a big area that more people could enjoy, and safer for the kiters too, especially children kiters. If you think about how the kites work, and how the winds usually are in that area, you'll realize the wind is coming into the bay at that point; kites catching it would be going off-shore, into the center of the bay area, not buzzing the shore where the trees would be blocking the breezes.
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By Jerry (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #30170) on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 11:00 pm: |
Good point Ruth. Truth be told, what upsets me the most is the people renting boats at the Plaza..I watched them for years just driving by waving,,,not looking at all...Louise almost got nailed last year.....What, people are in the water?
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By Ruth van Tilburg (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1437) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 1:24 am: |
That is upsetting and dangerous Jerry, and chances are boat rentals happen every day. I wonder what renters are taught? Albeit not life-threateningly dangerous, except to the reef and my stress level, are all the guests I see in the water at Windsock, jumping on the coral, sitting on it, standing on it, etc. (well, that part is kinda funny when it's fire coral; mother nature's punishment, but it still ticks me off). I frequently tell these people, 'please don't do that, you're killing the coral' and just as frequently get blank, clueless, or angry, could-care-less stares. Sometimes they stop; more times they don't (and yes, I do state this in other languages). There are many many more non-diving visitors now than I've ever seen before. They want to sit on the beach and sun themselves, and go in the water (not even to snorkel, just go in--these seem to be the folks stomping on the coral). What orientation are they given? From what I see, none. It also bugs me to no end when smokers plop themselves upwind of me & light up; but that's a personal issue.
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By Vince DePietro-www.bonairebeachcondo.com (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3353) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 7:30 am: |
Thanks for your input Ruth..Personally, I don't have a big problem with kiters out at Cai. Primarily this is because I really don't dive that area much, but others do. Therein lies the problem. I really don't think the two sports mix well.
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By Menno (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #378) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 10:01 am: |
The Home of Diving Freedom that is Habitat - not Bonaire!. Bonaire is, at least that is what the license-plates tell us, Divers Paradise. This means, at least to me, that this is a Paradise island to Divers...... Hmmmm.... Let's see.....;
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By Stephen Tise (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #106) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 10:37 am: |
Firstly I'd like to thank everyone who has taken the time to read my post and especially those who have decided to participate in the discussion. I remind everybody that this discussion was started in the kitesurfing and windsurfing thread. I only brought it here because I want people who dont regularly read that thread to know the situation. You only have to read that thread to see folks like Jerry and Brian are not part of a solution. There continued sharp tongues only serve their interest, they dont have anything constructive to say so they attack me. For those of you that have an interest in exploring the options at Lac please let your voices be heard. I've introduced this discussion many times and finally think there is broader support than ever before. Dont let these people beat me up and defeat your interests.
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By Stephen Tise (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #107) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 10:45 am: |
KOB, I'm also sorry that you feel bludgeoned. I dont mean to speak of my own feelings, just to remind folks that many here on Bonaire Talk are always getting spoken for when it comes to this. This really isnt about me at all. If I owned property on the Island I might like the idea of a green sport that is environmentally sound and has the potential to double if not triple the revenue produced through windsurfing at Lac. Given the state of windsurfing thats a conservative number.
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By Ruth van Tilburg (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1438) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 10:49 am: |
A place for everything, and everything in its place-I agree Menno, this is how it should be, and if one knowingly crosses into the other then that person crossing over has the responsibility to be extra vigilant. I agree too, clueless boaters are a menace to the reef & others (same as clueless bathers). Why no orientation for every visitor?
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By KOB (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #344) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 12:03 pm: |
Stephen -- you are entitled to your views and to express them here. Nothing personal ... what I meant by bludgeoned is that the discussion was going along fine on the Kitesailing, Windsurfing thread, but seems to have migrated to this thread and maybe others, requiring us to read about this topic on multiple threads. I support and encourage the discussion, but not across the entire BT.
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By Ruth van Tilburg (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1439) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 12:06 pm: |
A place for everything, and everything in its place-I agree Menno, this is how it should be, and if one knowingly crosses into the other then that person crossing over has the responsibility to be extra extra vigilant (duh). Where do divers want to go more, Atlantis & nearby sites where the kiters are now, or the middle of Lac? If you had a child who wanted to learn how to kite-surf, where would you be more comfortable? At Lac (where you're blown inland), or off the coast where you can be blown out to sea?
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By Ruth van Tilburg (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1440) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 12:08 pm: |
Sorry for the near double-post--didn't realize I posted my unfinished comment at 10:49 above.
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By Brian ******* (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4816) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 3:34 pm: |
Some people you can talk to and some people talk at you. I feel from the past postings and not listening to the replies that Stephen fits into the latter section. I am not rarely so blunt but sometimes after many attempts then this is the correct approach and so Stephen wins my slinky award.
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By Just little ole me with a (*) (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #6160) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 3:38 pm: |
Seems like there is a need for an "Orientation to Bonaire Pamphlet" that will get to more people then the ones that sit down at the initial dive orientation.
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By Vince DePietro-www.bonairebeachcondo.com (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3356) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 6:40 pm: |
Well, I really think when it comes to combining all the aforementioned activities, it all comes down to simple courtesy, consideration and just plain old common sense. Unfortunately, as one of the founders of our country observed, there's nothing common about common sense. Still holds true today.
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By pat murphy (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #2799) on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 9:52 pm: |
i like the idea of the "Orientation to Bonaire Pamphlet". i wonder if it's feasible to hand them out on the inbound planes (everybody needs some reading material on long flights) or if they could be given out at immigration upon arrival. good idea.
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By Vince DePietro-www.bonairebeachcondo.com (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3357) on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 7:16 am: |
Since TCB has been so instrumental in increasing the cruise ship trade, this Orientation pamphlet should be produced by them.
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By Freddie................someoneisawizeass (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #15360) on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 7:47 am: |
great idea Vince
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By Stephen Tise (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #109) on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 11:45 am: |
Brian, Thanks you for your well put and constructive comments. No doubt the kids are just rolling around laughing. BT, please discipline the child, it seems wholly unfair to put up with Brians continued harassment. I have and will maintain higher ground than that afforded me. I'm sure I speak for many when I say his comments do little to advance the conversation. I could resort to such immaturity but out of respect for the moderators I will not.
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By pat murphy (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #2801) on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 11:51 am: |
looks like this topic has reached an impasse. maybe it's time to put it to rest...at least on these boards.
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By Pietri Hausmann (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #469) on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 11:56 am: |
cruise ship passengers always have an orientation pamphlet issued by the the ship in cooperation with the TCB and tour operators. and on tours we also provide the publications Bonaire Night's and/or Bonaire Affair to each tourist as well as as other occasional relevant information. So the cruisers are informed....
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By Vince DePietro-www.bonairebeachcondo.com (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #3358) on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 12:57 pm: |
Thanks Pietri..I wasn't aware of that.
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By Menno (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #379) on Tuesday, December 21, 2010 - 9:16 am: |
To me that sounds more like one more piece of paper that will end up blowing into the ocean, or, if used correct, ends up on our landfill. Why is it necessary to inform new arrivals about the natural beauty and how to cope with that fragile world in the first place?? I like to think that new arrivals come to Bonaire for that!!
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By Brian ******* (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4817) on Tuesday, December 21, 2010 - 4:56 pm: |
Please Miss excuse me but Stephen's telling tales.
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By Stephen Tise (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #113) on Friday, December 24, 2010 - 11:50 am: |
Brian your dogma is useless against common sense. If anyone wants to hear my real opinion on Brian and his "terse" crapola and thoroughly rational reasoning, please refer to the Kitesufing Windsurfing thread where his brilliant mind shines...STOP THE VOICES!!
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By Brian ******* (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4835) on Friday, December 24, 2010 - 12:16 pm: |
removed for impolite context.
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By Freddie {Moderator} (Moderator - Post #1080) on Friday, December 24, 2010 - 12:18 pm: |
this thread is closed.... It is Christmas Eve please everyone go to your respected corners and have a nice night and a wonderful day tomorrow.
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